What's the big deal about letting Russia annex Crimea?

[tupac chopra]

[quote=""aupmanyav""]Ukraine should have been careful not to annoy a powerful neighbor.[/quote]It's Putin that has annoyed the Neocons.

“Our first objective is to prevent the reemergence of a new rival, either on the territory of the former Soviet Union or elsewhere, that poses a threat on the order of that posed by the Soviet Union. This … requires that we endeavor to prevent any hostile power from dominating a region whose resources would, under consolidated control, be sufficient to generate global power. These regions include Western Europe, East Asia, the territory of the former Soviet Union, and Southwest Asia.” Zbigniew Brzezinski, The Grand Chessboard

[Loren Pechtel]

[quote=""tupac chopra""]

. nope its all the cia.. everything in the world is a US conspiracy.

The evidence appears to be that in this case it was a US conspiracy.
1.They invested $5B in the Ukraine.
2.Hacked emails and phone calls show US and NATO involvement in the coup.
3.John Brennan secretly paid a visit to the people who took power away from a democratically elected government.
3.Money has been provided or is in the pipeline to be provided, to the illegal government.
4.The US has moved troops in the nearby area, and warships.
5.It is a matter of history that the CIA has done this sort of thing before.
6.The US and NATO have been shown to be spreading lies and disinformation following the coup.
Isn't that a conspiracy?[/QUOTE]

You're listening to some pretty dodgy sources.

The reality is that Russia tried to take over Ukraine from within, subverting the power structure. The people threw out their puppet so they're resorting to military means.

[DrZoidberg]

[quote=""barbos""]

Got a report from a guy who is living in Crimea. Not my friend. But the contact of a friend who used to be a journalist. Here is goes: He says that Crimeans to walking around high on life, as if they're on drugs. That's a quote btw. The general opinion is that the Russian annexation is the best thing that has ever happened to them. They're all looking forward to the moment when there are no more queues, no corruption, clean streets, good economy, lots of jobs and everything works. To anybody who knows anything this is stupid and unrealistic. Russia has no plans on investing shit in Crimea. Nothing will change. Smart and educated people know this. So, we can all look forward to a massive backlash when the truth sinks in. But by then it'll probably be too late for Crimea.

By staying a part of Ukraine they at least have a sporting chance to sort themselves out. If they're in Russia they're fucked. Ukraine might change. With Putin at the helm, there's no chance Russia changes. And he seems to be sitting fairly safely in his seat.

There is still the possibility that Putin backs down and gives Crimea back. Especially once the backlash arrives. But that all depends on how this all develops politically. The truth of the matter is that Russia does not want Crimea. It's more trouble than it's worth. A pure cost taxing an already strained economy. Rampant corruption among the worst in the world. They already have the military bases. There is nothing more they could possibly want from Crimea. For Putin this is purely a matter of propaganda. As long as keeping Crimea makes him look good to the Russians, he'll likely keep it.

Actually, Putin have learned "throw money at the problem" trick pretty well.
So rest assured, crimeans are better off in Russia, at least untill Ukraine is new Poland which is not happeneing any time soon.[/QUOTE]

We'll see. Throwing money at a corrupt region is quite literally to throw the money away.

[4321lynx]

[quote=""Loren Pechtel""]

The evidence appears to be that in this case it was a US conspiracy.
1.They invested $5B in the Ukraine.
2.Hacked emails and phone calls show US and NATO involvement in the coup.
3.John Brennan secretly paid a visit to the people who took power away from a democratically elected government.
3.Money has been provided or is in the pipeline to be provided, to the illegal government.
4.The US has moved troops in the nearby area, and warships.
5.It is a matter of history that the CIA has done this sort of thing before.
6.The US and NATO have been shown to be spreading lies and disinformation following the coup.
Isn't that a conspiracy?

You're listening to some pretty dodgy sources.

The reality is that Russia tried to take over Ukraine from within, subverting the power structure. The people threw out their puppet so they're resorting to military means.[/QUOTE]

Sure. Putin would love to have Ukraine or some part of it the way he, at present, has Byelarus. And the US & Eastern Europeans want it in "Europe" +/- in NATO. The rest of Europe,especially Germany who finances "everything" there, - not so much.

And all's fair in love and war, and might is right, (as exemplified by Israel vs Arabs), and there is little love lost between the US and Russia.

[barbos]

[quote=""DrZoidberg""]

Actually, Putin have learned "throw money at the problem" trick pretty well.
So rest assured, crimeans are better off in Russia, at least untill Ukraine is new Poland which is not happeneing any time soon.

We'll see. Throwing money at a corrupt region is quite literally to throw the money away.[/QUOTE]

Corruption is relative. Crimea is no more corrupt than the rest of the Russia, probably less.
And Europe/US are pretty corrupt too, they are just better at hiding it.

[barbos]

[quote=""Loren Pechtel""]

. nope its all the cia.. everything in the world is a US conspiracy.

The evidence appears to be that in this case it was a US conspiracy.
1.They invested $5B in the Ukraine.
2.Hacked emails and phone calls show US and NATO involvement in the coup.
3.John Brennan secretly paid a visit to the people who took power away from a democratically elected government.
3.Money has been provided or is in the pipeline to be provided, to the illegal government.
4.The US has moved troops in the nearby area, and warships.
5.It is a matter of history that the CIA has done this sort of thing before.
6.The US and NATO have been shown to be spreading lies and disinformation following the coup.
Isn't that a conspiracy?

You're listening to some pretty dodgy sources.

The reality is that Russia tried to take over Ukraine from within, subverting the power structure. The people threw out their puppet so they're resorting to military means.[/QUOTE]
It's you who is listening to dodgy sources.

That's a kind of crap you are listening too
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2 ... spies.html

Intel is producing taped conversations of intelligence operatives taking their orders from Moscow and everybody can tell the difference in the accents, in the idioms, in the language.

There is no fucking way to tell russian speaking ukrainian from russian.
In fact there is no fucking way to tell ukrainian ukrainian from russian if he/she speaks russian.
I know it may come as a surprise to americans but russian language is not english, there is practically no regional accents, 95% of native speaking russians speak identical language and have identical accent. Russia is not US.
So Kerry is talking straight from his ass, it's Niger's Yellow Cake bullshit again.

[barbos]

The intercepts also come as more proof has mounted inside Ukraine that Russia is behind the provocations, uprisings and other actions aimed at ripping the country apart. On Monday Ukraine's internal security service claimed they caught the self appointed separatist deputy mayor of Slavyansk with cash and encryption equipment on a return trip from Moscow

That's fucking hilarious.
looks like NSA/CIA is not that powerful if they have to rely on these people for the info.
I wonder if they provided these forged pictures too.

[mrp]

[quote=""barbos""]

You're listening to some pretty dodgy sources.

The reality is that Russia tried to take over Ukraine from within, subverting the power structure. The people threw out their puppet so they're resorting to military means.

It's you who is listening to dodgy sources.

That's a kind of crap you are listening too
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2 ... spies.html

Intel is producing taped conversations of intelligence operatives taking their orders from Moscow and everybody can tell the difference in the accents, in the idioms, in the language.

There is no fucking way to tell russian speaking ukrainian from russian.
In fact there is no fucking way to tell ukrainian ukrainian from russian if he/she speaks russian.
I know it may come as a surprise to americans but russian language is not english, there is practically no regional accents, 95% of native speaking russians speak identical language and have identical accent. Russia is not US.
So Kerry is talking straight from his ass, it's Niger's Yellow Cake bullshit again.[/QUOTE]

Once again reality disagrees with you.. shocking!


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_dialects
http://therussianblog.wordpress.com/201 ... -language/

As do russian born, russian speaking journalists that can tell the difference

[barbos]

[quote=""mrp""]

You're listening to some pretty dodgy sources.

The reality is that Russia tried to take over Ukraine from within, subverting the power structure. The people threw out their puppet so they're resorting to military means.

It's you who is listening to dodgy sources.

That's a kind of crap you are listening too
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2 ... spies.html

Intel is producing taped conversations of intelligence operatives taking their orders from Moscow and everybody can tell the difference in the accents, in the idioms, in the language.

There is no fucking way to tell russian speaking ukrainian from russian.
In fact there is no fucking way to tell ukrainian ukrainian from russian if he/she speaks russian.
I know it may come as a surprise to americans but russian language is not english, there is practically no regional accents, 95% of native speaking russians speak identical language and have identical accent. Russia is not US.
So Kerry is talking straight from his ass, it's Niger's Yellow Cake bullshit again.

Once again reality disagrees with you.. shocking!


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_dialects
http://therussianblog.wordpress.com/201 ... -language/

As do russian born, russian speaking journalists that can tell the difference[/QUOTE]
Complete and utter bullshit, as I said 90% people have no identifiable accent whatsoever.
To find accents you need to go certain villages in certain regions
And need I remind you that I am russian and know a little bit more about that than you?

[barbos]

US/NATO miscalculated when they started this mess by supporting people who are now in power.
Now they try this ridiculous propaganda stories to cover their mistakes.
US public appears to take this grabage as a truth, but in the end, it is ukrainians (including russian ukrainians) who decide what is the truth, not US media and stupid politicians.